4L30E Transmission rebuild

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4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:54 pm

Hey all,

I am about to rebuild the transmission in my 2002 trooper as it's leaking somewhere in the bell housing and seeping out through the inspection plate. I have been able to find a lot of help on here with how to remove the transmission and such, how I need a zero offset 17mm wrench to remove the bolts on the flexplate, but I have also seen people mention that the 00-02 troopers had a different torque converter then the rodeo and such. My first question is where do I find the correct torque converter for my trooper? I've seen listings on Ebay, and one from Florida torque converters but I'm still unsure as to whether they would really work for my trooper.

Ebay Torque Converter

FTC Torque Converter

My second qeustions is are the rebuild kits from PA Cargo any good, Rockauto has some in stock and I'm looking at getting it from there.

Rebuild kit from rockauto

Last qeustion is, once I get the transmission out what should I use to clean it? one person mentioned carb cleaner and I didn't see any other recommendations. My plans so far are to drop the transmission using a transmission jack and following the instructions here, take it apart slowly on camera labeling everything that comes out and putting it in plastic bags, then slowly rebuilding it referencing the ATSG repair manual and the instruction manual made by Hans Verhoeven. I also have the isuzu service manual if I need more instuction on how to rebuild it. I'm planning on using a deluxe rebuild kit, replaicing all the shift solinoids, and replacing the torque converter, as it has been shifting weird the past few months anyway. I'm a college student and the summer is really the only time I'll have to do any major repairs before school as repairing this myself at school wouyldn't be an option.

Thanks for any help you can give, I'll probably have more questions once I get the transmission out.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Buster28 » Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:53 am

Skeeter256 wrote:Hey all,

I am about to rebuild the transmission in my 2002 trooper as it's leaking somewhere in the bell housing and seeping out through the inspection plate. I have been able to find a lot of help on here with how to remove the transmission and such, how I need a zero offset 17mm wrench to remove the bolts on the flexplate, but I have also seen people mention that the 00-02 troopers had a different torque converter then the rodeo and such. My first question is where do I find the correct torque converter for my trooper? I've seen listings on Ebay, and one from Florida torque converters but I'm still unsure as to whether they would really work for my trooper.

Ebay Torque Converter

FTC Torque Converter

This link provides info about PWM Torque Converters
https://www.transtar1.com/TranstarIndus ... TC-035.pdf
This link also provides info on the clutch material used in PWM torque converters.
https://www.sonnax.com/tech_resources/2 ... n-material
00-02 Troopers have a PWM controlled Torque Converter installed so the clutch needs to be woven carbon.
The eBay listing for the FTC 54-40 Torque Converter indicates it has a woven carbon clutch friction.
Skeeter256 wrote:My second qeustions is are the rebuild kits from PA Cargo any good, Rockauto has some in stock and I'm looking at getting it from there.

Parts Authority sells name brand transmission parts.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Sun Jun 21, 2020 5:25 pm

Thanks, Buster.

Time to order parts.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:21 pm

Ok, I’ve gotten the trans out and was dissembling it when I noticed that the drums the clutch plates go on are slightly deformed. Does this mean I need to find replacements?

Imgur link

Sorry, I couldn’t get it to display my pictures in post.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Oro » Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:51 pm

Mine were like that, too. Maybe not quite as bad. Jerry told me to just dress them with a file to clean it up and then go along my merry way.

Remember to flush out your cooler if you had bad debris inside the unit. Lubegard makes "Kooler Kleen" that does that; I just improvised with compressed air and gasoline sprayed through.

Note that the ATSG manual does not show the correct disc/plate order for most baskets; use your notes or pics and not the manual - it pictures earlier versions.

While you have your trans out, a new rear main seal is not a bad idea. I would also strongly recommend taking care of the cats at the same time while they are out. PM me about that. I added a temp gauge and aux cooler, which have made me confident ever since (neither is difficult or very expensive). Another suggestion, is that while you have the transmission out: it is easy to retro-fit a dipstick for future convenience. The PA kit likely came with the necessary gasket once you drill the hole. Just get a take-off tube/stick from a wrecker or possibly someone on the list here.
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Home rebuilt 4L30E doing great. Aux cooler and temp gauge. Big thanks on the rebuild to Buster28, Jerry (jlemond), CalG, and others.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 11:44 pm

Thanks for the reply.

All the transmission fluid is brown and has a burnt small to it so definitely going to have to flush everything. It doesn’t appear any of the non metal clutch plates are degraded though.

You mention a new rear main seal, is that on the engine or the transmission? Also what do by you mean by taking care of the cats? I’m in New England so I don’t believe it’s going to need an extra trans cooler.

On a side note some of the plastic tabs on the electrical harness broke trying to remove it. Does anyone know a good source of these? I would need both and the plug for the overdrive wiring harness.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Oro » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:49 am

If your friction discs did not burn up and throw disc material everywhere, then I would just run a hose up from the cooler and pour clean atf through it until it runs clear out the other end; no need to get extreme with a commercial product or solvent flushing.

The rear main seal is on the engine crankshaft, underneath the flexplate. If it ever leaks, you have to remove the transmission to change it. It's like $4. Examine the steel discs for areas of heat tempering/spot hardening. If you had enough temp to burn fluid, or to tear up discs, then that may have happened. Most of my 3rd clutch steels showed discoloration in spots indicative of that, so I changed them. It's a case-by-case thing.

As to the cooler, your summers are much hotter than mine, and I still value my cooler for keeping my truck's fluid temps down. Up to you, but they are cheap and it's good insurance. It will add about 25 minutes to the re-install time - easy to do with the system disconnected.

Cats for these are hard to find (there appear to be no direct-fit aftermarket ones at all), and install. They won't last a whole lot longer unless you have really low miles on your truck. PM me and I can mention options.
1998 Acura SLX. OME 929s and front crank, KYB tubes. Retro'd Aisin manual front hubs.
Home rebuilt 4L30E doing great. Aux cooler and temp gauge. Big thanks on the rebuild to Buster28, Jerry (jlemond), CalG, and others.
Factory(US dealer) side steps and roof/ski rack (Yakima).
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:36 pm

Hey all,

I’m currently assembling everything and I’m having trouble installing the overdrive housing. The old thrust washer didn’t have any plastic legs but is black/dark green in color. I bought a set of thrust washers of a bunch of different colors and tried using the black one to see how it fits. It prevents the overdrive housing from mating with the main housing with a 5 mm gap between the two. Is this a problem with the thrust washers I bought or did something not get installed correctly? I removed the thrust washer completely and it mated pretty closely. The old thrust washer would reduce this gap, should I reuse it?
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Oro » Sat Jul 04, 2020 1:55 am

I would mount it up with the old thrust washer and check the end play. You can get reasonably accurate with a good set of calipers vs. the factory Rube Goldberg device.

When I rebuilt mine, I couldn't find a thrust washer kit. Recently I saw them more readily available on Ebay and elsewhere. Mine was slightly out of spec but I went with it, no harm so far. ;)

Did you find the work-around to cross-cut the OD housing bolts and use the tc as the fitting jig? IIRC, I bookmarked a youtube video on that on a Ford transmission...

Ah, here it is! This is important to get this correct.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-L71-udS_g&app=desktop

Since the bolts thread the other way, take a dremel and cross-cut the ends, then you can cinch them up with a screwdriver, since you can't get at the bolt heads.

If the background music in that video sounds familiar but indistinct, it's this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjSZs_uOWxg

(humor)
1998 Acura SLX. OME 929s and front crank, KYB tubes. Retro'd Aisin manual front hubs.
Home rebuilt 4L30E doing great. Aux cooler and temp gauge. Big thanks on the rebuild to Buster28, Jerry (jlemond), CalG, and others.
Factory(US dealer) side steps and roof/ski rack (Yakima).
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Sun Jul 19, 2020 9:27 pm

Sorry for not replaying sooner. Also, thanks for the great video.

Currently I’m waiting for a second rear main seal to arrive as the first one had a broken paper gasket. I am also waiting for a feeler gauge with .0015” thickness so I can properly install the Sonnax front bushing. Looks like I’m also going to be raplacing exhaust studs that go to the cats. Oro, you mentioned that those will go bad soon, what is the signs of the cats going bad for future reference. Also, I was able to find proper Isuzu studs and they’re running $7 a piece, whereas m12x1.50 studs cost $12 for a 6 piece lot with the studs and flange nuts. The only difference being the Isuzu studs have m12x1.5 on the manifold side and and m12x1.25 on the cat side. Should I go factory or save the money and get the easier to find product. I’m going to replace them all due to the rust damage leaving barely any thread.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Oro » Sun Jul 19, 2020 10:23 pm

" Looks like I’m also going to be raplacing exhaust studs that go to the cats. Oro, you mentioned that those will go bad soon, what is the signs of the cats going bad for future reference."

I was able to find or order the proper die and I rehab-ed my existing threads. it wasn't easy, I had to use several LONG 1/2" extensions and a cheater bar to cut the new threads, but even with that, it was simpler than replacing the studs.

The first symptom of a failed cat is a crazy rattling sound under the floor boards; you will think your transmission has a loose wrench in it. Driveability is not affected, you usually can't tell unless you try to rev to the red line and then it might be choked down. In most cases, the material will break up before long and it goes away. hopefully, not clogging the remaining honeycomb. This is going to happen at some point. If your cats are out and on the ground, deal with them now unless you are going to sell the truck within a year.
1998 Acura SLX. OME 929s and front crank, KYB tubes. Retro'd Aisin manual front hubs.
Home rebuilt 4L30E doing great. Aux cooler and temp gauge. Big thanks on the rebuild to Buster28, Jerry (jlemond), CalG, and others.
Factory(US dealer) side steps and roof/ski rack (Yakima).
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:50 pm

I put everything back in yesterday. I have filled it on a level surface with a pump then let the extra drain out. I’m having a problem we’re it starts in 3rd when the selector is in drive. 1st works in L, it doesn’t work with the shift selector in 2nd, 3rd, or drive. I replaced all the shift solenoids and adjusted the band. Seems like it might be a bad solenoid but would liked some advice before tearing back into it.

Ps. I cleaned out the mode selector switch and readjusted it using a multimeter. I then only got continuity in neutral and park.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Oro » Thu Jul 30, 2020 4:18 pm

Skeeter256 wrote: I have filled it on a level surface with a pump then let the extra drain out.


...
Ps. I cleaned out the mode selector switch and readjusted it using a multimeter. I then only got continuity in neutral and park.


1) Just to double check but you likely know, it was running when it filled to draining, and you re-installed the fill/check plug before turning it off?

2) I don't recall the meter method of RMS adjustment clearly; I vaguely recall it was described. I used the simpler drill bit method of RMS alignment suggested in the ATSG manual and that worked great. Not sure that this could be an RMS issue or not; I'm not expert enough (or at all). Did you compare the results of the meter method to the alignment method?

Buster should have a better idea and be around soon.
1998 Acura SLX. OME 929s and front crank, KYB tubes. Retro'd Aisin manual front hubs.
Home rebuilt 4L30E doing great. Aux cooler and temp gauge. Big thanks on the rebuild to Buster28, Jerry (jlemond), CalG, and others.
Factory(US dealer) side steps and roof/ski rack (Yakima).
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Thu Jul 30, 2020 6:39 pm

Thanks oro,

The car was running when I filled the transmission. I also filled it a bit, ran trough all the gears, put it in neutral, then drained the excess and closed it up. I then took it for a drive and came back and checked the fluid again. The fluid was high so I let it drain and closed it up while running.

I looked trough the manuals and didn’t see the drill bit method you mentioned. The meter method I used came from the hans verhoeven manual.

I let it sit an hour and charged the battery, then took it for a another short drive. It was stuck in first and then it did try to come out of first one time and popped the code P0722 which has to do with the speed sensor not working. After that it in limp mode till I cleared the code. This time it was stuck in first and wouldn’t upshift, I then stopped the car and put it into winter drive and it went into third, I then took it out of winter mode and it wouldn’t downshift even when stopped. It took putting the car in park for a while for it to go back into first when drive was selected.

Not sure what it up with this thing. It seems capable of mechanically going into each gear, just doesn’t seem to know when to do it. I’m looking into the speed sensor as it seems that is the most likely cause.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Oro » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:33 pm

Skeeter256 wrote:=

I looked trough the manuals and didn’t see the drill bit method you mentioned. The meter method I used came from the hans verhoeven manual.
=


It's in this manual:

https://www.oregonperformancetransmissi ... 4L30E.html

Which is what I used along with advice here and also verhoeven. I don't have mine anymore to look it up for you, unfortunately. Someone here does of course so if you want to explore that, we can post a questions and someone can snap a pic or explain it.

Maybe it's related to a solenoid or one of those valve body check balls; Buster is going to know better. Good news, those are relatively easy to check or address if you have to since just the pan and possibly some of the valve body has to be removed, which can be done from underneath. That's probably the worst case scenario.
1998 Acura SLX. OME 929s and front crank, KYB tubes. Retro'd Aisin manual front hubs.
Home rebuilt 4L30E doing great. Aux cooler and temp gauge. Big thanks on the rebuild to Buster28, Jerry (jlemond), CalG, and others.
Factory(US dealer) side steps and roof/ski rack (Yakima).
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Buster28 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:57 am

Skeeter256 wrote:I put everything back in yesterday. I have filled it on a level surface with a pump then let the extra drain out. I’m having a problem we’re it starts in 3rd when the selector is in drive. 1st works in L, it doesn’t work with the shift selector in 2nd, 3rd, or drive. I replaced all the shift solenoids and adjusted the band. Seems like it might be a bad solenoid but would liked some advice before tearing back into it.

Ps. I cleaned out the mode selector switch and readjusted it using a multimeter. I then only got continuity in neutral and park.


If L (Manual 1st gear) is working OK but acceleration in D 1st gear is very slow it suggests that the transmission is actually in 4th gear as opposed to 1st gear. To select 1st gear in D range, the PCM energizes the shift B solenoid and de-energizes the shift A solenoid. If the shift B solenoid is inoperative the shift valves will be configured for 4th gear. In 4th gear, the 2nd and 3rd clutches are applied and the transmission section is operating in 3rd gear (1:1 ratio) . Additionally, the Overrun clutch is released and the Overdrive (4th) clutch is applied, so the overdrive section produces a 0.723 ratio. The combined overall ratio is 0.723 which makes for very slow acceleration.

In Winter Mode the shift B solenoid is de-energized and the shift A solenoid is energized. This solenoid state is opposite the 1st gear solenoid state. Therefore, if Winter Mode selects 3rd gear as expected but D 1st selects 4th gear it strongly suggests the shift B solenoid is inoperative. L (Manual 1st gear) and Reverse work OK because they do not require the shift solenoids or the Range Mode Switch (RMS) for gear selection.

"Limp Mode" de-energizes both solenoids which also causes a 4th gear start in D 1st gear. DTC P0722 is a Transmission Speed Sensor (TSS) fault, It can initiate "Limp Mode" if defective or not plugged in.
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Skeeter256 » Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:01 pm

I just found the problem, the trans speed sensor wasn’t connected. I’m guessing it never was. I just took it on a short trip and the transmission is shifting like butter.

Thanks a lot Oro and Buster for the help. You guys made my first transmission rebuild easy. I’m going to add a list to the top of this post of all the tools and parts I needed in hopes of helping others find them.

Fingers crossed it lasts.

Ps. Buster a video you posted in an other thread recently shows how to adjust the brake band piston. It mentions torquing to 40 inch pounds then backing the screw off 4 turns, whereas the verhoeven manual says 5 turns. I went the verhoeven manual route, will this have any effect on the longevity if this rebuild?
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Re: 4L30E Transmission rebuild

Postby Buster28 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 4:01 am

Skeeter256 wrote:Ps. Buster a video you posted in an other thread recently shows how to adjust the brake band piston. It mentions torquing to 40 inch pounds then backing the screw off 4 turns, whereas the verhoeven manual says 5 turns. I went the verhoeven manual route, will this have any effect on the longevity if this rebuild?

The Isuzu factory service manuals specify backing off 5 turns.
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